For your first discussion/reading post, go ahead and do the HW reading in Viewpoints ("To Err" and "In Praise").
Then, answer the following 2 questions (write 1 paragraph for each question):
1) Read "To Err is Wrong." Out of all his arguments in favor of making errors, what do you think von Oech's strongest points are? Why?
2) Read "In Praise of the F word." Do you agree that fear of failure can motivate students?
Due: Wed, 2/4, before class
Reminder: In order to post your response, click on "comments" next to the little pencil icon at the bottom of this post. Then type your response. Click on the drop-down menu and choose "NAME/URL" and just type your name in. Then click "Post Comment." Then you're done!
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1.) I think that out of all his arguments i think the strongest ones are that making errors are okay. That people that make mistakes learn from them and are able to set a stepping stone for themselves to succeed. Making an error is a learning process that some people have to go through to move forward with what they are doing. Also, to make whatever that is stronger. In society today people get the impression that when you make an error that you will get laughed at or be doing something wrong. Oech is trying to say that society has us thinking that errors only create bad things. When in reality errors are good for change.
ReplyDelete2.) In some ways i think that yes if a student knows they are going to fail they will try harder. I also feel that why would a student listen to a teacher when like it said in the passage that teachers only use it to motivate students and they dont anctually fail that student. Some teachers only do it to actually see if the student will try harder. What if they dont? Then you fail them? and if they do then you pass them? I dont really get the concept. But i do agree that if you tell the student that they will fail if something is not done that it it will truly make them start working harder.
1) His strongest point is to use your mistake as a stepping stone for new ideas. He also said there are two benefits to failure, first when you fail u learn from your mistake and second it gives u a new approch. To me it is true because the only way of learning is through failing. But you have to want to try a new way of thinking, ify ou do not you will never sucssed. So first you have to see what made you fail and second you have to learn from it to have a new approach the second time.
ReplyDelete2) I agree because some students want to pass so they fear failing. When you fear something u don't want it to happen to you. First the teacher doesn't fail the student, the student fails on his/her own. Most of them want to pass or sucssed so the try not to fail, but ofthers just don't try. But if they fail and want to pass they will try harder the next time because they don't want to fail in other words they fear it.
1.)Von Oech's strongest argument was talking about how we learn from our mistakes. If we were all good at everything that we did we would never be learning anything new. In order to learn new ways and ideas you have to experiment and make mistakes to figure out what's wrong and what's right, and how to get that right answer.
ReplyDelete2.)This is true for some student's, Their afraid of what their parents might do, or their afraid of what will be taken away from them. For other students that don't have much to loose or that just don't care this isn't true. For me knowing that I was going to fail a class didn't motivate me to do better, even though I knew I would get in trouble. I felt like I had nothing to work for,no motivation.I had to WANT to do better.For some student's that never happens.I think most people need to have a goal or some sort of motivation, the fear of failing isn't always enough.
I think Vons presents very strong points and a one of them was when he said “ Errors serve another useful purpose: they tell us when to change direction.” This makes a lot o sense to and it seems that in history any new invention has come from trial and error. Finding a different approach to solve a problem and reinventing inventions to make them more useful. I also thought that when he said “ Most people consider success and failure as opposites, but they are actually both products of the same process” was a good supporting detail for Vons argument.
ReplyDeleteI believe that failure can motivate some people but I do not think that all people are motivated by failure. Too much failure can make a person give up on a task while it makes others more aggressive at finding answers.
Ihink von oech's strongest point in favor of making erroes is stated as Yaz would put it "if you want the hits, be prepared for the misse." Van Oech states that being concered with only reaching the right answer one will probably make uncritical use of rules ,formulas and proceduure used to get the right answers. Doing this will cause to by-pass a phase of the creative process. Assumption won't be tested rules wont be challeged and no what if question. There will be no creative thinking! this is a driffrent logic, but very true. I feltthis was strongest,next to errors as stepping stones. Getting the right answer is not always easy,and errors come up to challeged us. this is a stong point.
ReplyDelete2.) i agree with the fea of failer can motivate students.Not all students,but the majority. The author story about his son is a good exsample of a student that had a potential of being a great student,but didnt use intilkl he was givin the ultimate choice.Good for mrs,stifer! The fear of failure can motivate students by looking around and seeing job opertunities for the undfer skilled. Sometimes when friends or family , who could have done better , failer and contiune to do badly in their livies, can make you relize that you dont want to head this way. this can be great motivation to succeed
I would have to say that Von Oechs strongest points were that people who dont make any mistakes are like robots doing everything perfect and never failing in whatever they do ,but in the same time by them being so perfect they dont get to experience anything new like a new way of learning something different because they are afrade of failing ,in which if they had tryed it a new way they would have discovered and its just a different way of doing something and its not failing.
ReplyDeleteI agree and disagree at the same time because the thought of failure could motive a person just because they dont want to fail, but at the same time they could feel like theres no more hope in passing and just give up also they might feel that the teacher or whoever is failing them has already given up on them ( so why even try). in the end i thinks its just what kind of person it happeneds to everyone is diffrent.
1.) I believe that Von Oech's strongest points were Errors as Stepping Stones. He explains that by making mistakes is what brought us here today. That every inventor or successful person failed at one point in there life. i believe this point is strong because making mistakes only makes us stronger, and teaches us how to do better.
ReplyDelete2.) I do believe that by threatening a student of failing may motivate them, but at the same time I think it depends on the student. I believe people will do what they want to do when they want to do it. So if i student chooses not to put school first, a simple threat from a teacher will not be motivating to them. I believe that it would depend entirely on the student, and how bad failing the class would effect him.
1. Von Oech strongest arguement in "To Err Is Wrong" is that making mistakes are stepping stone to new ideas. He explains that making mistakes is part of a learning experience. That if we put ourselves in situations where we might fail, that it leads to conservative thought patterns designed to avoid the stigma our society puts on failure. He further explains that all great ideas were from mistakes. Von Oech gives details of our history where many inventors used error as stepping stone to the greatest achievements of our times.
ReplyDelete2. Threatening a student of failing can have varied outcomes from one individual to another. I personally get motivated when a person doubts my success. However, others can have their different experience. For a student to be truly motivated, they themselves need to put school as a priority. It wouldn't help if teachers of parents were to threatened of failing, if their heart isn't at the right mind set.
1) I think out of all of his arguments he made it seem like errors are okay, and we should not be affraid of them. I liked the example he used about animals and adaptation, and how the species evolving was a mistake or an error. It is just a different way to look at errors. Making mistakes is not a bad thing as long as we can learn and grow from them. Whether they are in school or in life it is impossible not to make mistakes because no one is perfect.
ReplyDelete2)I think that in some cases fear can motivate students to do better, but I would probably use it as a last resort. Some teacher i have had in the past went straight to "If you do not do this assignment you WILL fail," and it did work, but threating students is not a good way to get them to do their work. Some people can are just extremely motivated and do not need pushing, but others just cannot seem to get themselves to do the work. I am on the fence with whether or not it is a good idea to install fear in students to get them to do their work.
1) I think Oech made a good poing in quoting the baseball player; when he said he had been up to bat over ten thousand times and was unsuccessful over seven thousand times, it showed that you have to look at the big picture and not focus on the little errors you make. If in the end you succeed then a little failure on the way shouldn't matter.
ReplyDelete2)I absolutely think fear of failure will put a fire under you to do well. Most people don't try their hardest if they think there will be no consequence to it. As soon as someone's success in threatened, they often try their hardest to succeed to stray away from failure.
1.) I think one of Von Oech's strongest point is his comment on how from youth we are taught that the "correct" answers are good and that "wrong answers are bad. Which in my opinion is a very generic way of thinking. This way of thinking could produce fear of failure, which in a way could turn into fear of success for some people. If we are afraid to try we will never succeed. He also points out that throughout history there have been many great discoveries through the art of erring. Another good observation that Oech makes is realizing that there can be benefits to making mistakes or even failing. Many times we only notice failure when our status quo has been disrupted.
ReplyDelete2.) Fear in a way can be a good motivator, but i don't believe that we should focus solely on the negativities of failure. Some students may need encouragement, others may need to focus on self- discipline, while others may actually benefit from this method. The point is we cannot treat them as a mass. You never know what hides beneath the struggles of a young student. A potential latent negative affect this method could have is lack of motivation in a student.
1) I think that Oech made a good example using his female friend that graduated with a master's degree. For 18 years she has never failed in school. Now she is ready to fail. I think that example tells us that in life "to fail" is part of growing up and failing. We learn from our mistakes and we still live making more mistakes and growing from it.
ReplyDelete2) I think that everyone is different in this world. The fear of failure would motivate some students that look at education as a priority. But others it wouldn't, for some they don't need to be motivated they do it on their own. I know that I have been threatened by a teacher in the past that if I don't pay attention in class I will fail.
I thing that his stonges point is that you don't need to be correct all the time. If you are always correct were does the learning expirince come from. Seeing the things as correct or wrong is what you are thought in school. By failing you are learning that there are many diferent ways to view something and that not everything has one single answer. That is what I think is his stong point.
ReplyDeleteYes, I think that it does motivate some students. Some students are modivated once they learned that they are really close to getthing an "f" because they are afraid of failure. They don't want to admit that they may not bee good at everything. The fear of failur modivates even the students that with no problem can get an "A" on anything. That is why I thing that failing modivates students.
1) I think his strongest points are making error is not a shameful thing, its actually strong stepstones for the better idea. Most of people say that error is wrong and if you have error then you did something wrong. But in this article its says that's wrong, because if there is no error then there is no better idea. No matter people like being fail or not, they fail at least once in a whole life and this book belives that, if they overcome that situtaion then they will become more stronger. Therefore there is no shame to make error or fail. It's better to experience and fail then not doing anything.
ReplyDelete2) I think fear of failure can motivate students. Because I believe taht Most students study and pass the class because they want to be succse, In other way they study, pass the classes and succes because they dont want to fail. This is why i believe that fear of failure acutally can be motivate to students not only to students but to anyone.
I think that Von has very strong points towards errors and for one is that it is okay to make mistakes that we have two benefits from it. One if you fail you have learn it doesnt work and second failure give you a chase to try again. when i read this i thought that i could make mistakes and try again. that helps us learn from our mistake because no one is perfect.
ReplyDeleteYes, I think fear motives some what students. For example I get motived by fear just think that i might get an F in any of my class. Wouldn't any one? Well maybe not everyone is to interested in school like some of us.
1).I believe that Oech's strongest point is that making a mistake isn't bad, it actually creates a stone/path for you to see what went wrong. He also gave a example of people who made erroneous assumptions and fail ideas as steppin stones for new ideas. This argument has many good point, and explain that not all failures are bad, "The failure gives you an apportunity to try a new approach".
ReplyDelete2).i agree that fear of failing can motivate students to try their best. In this article the student didnt care about the grade until he was told about consequences. If they have the presure of failing i think they will try alot to get a passing grade. It has happend to me, i did really care until i saw the F, then i had to work extra in order to not fail.
1.) I thin his strongest arguments are the fact that he uses other successful peoples failures as examples of how event the most smartest person can fail, but learn from their mistakes to succeed.
ReplyDelete2.) Yes, I do believe fear of failure motivates students because I know it sure worked on me. I think with other students they just dont realize what can be the consequence in failing and they dont take it serious until they are told they wont be getting ahead because of the fact they arent doing there part in keeping a good grade.